Curse

Silmor · May 14, 2005, 01:20 PM // 13:20

This probably won't be a very popular suggestion, but I find that the resurrection shrines in explorable areas take away a lot of the challenge the game offered. Getting wiped out as a party should be the end of your adventure, not just a temporary setback; it means you failed as a team, and should rethink your builds, equipment and tactics before attempting again (or to return at a later time when your character levelled a bit).

Right now most explorable areas can be entirely cleared by simply hurtling yourself at a group of opponents - as long as you take one down before you die yourself, you'll get there eventually. This gives the opportunity to brute-force your way through quests and areas, instead of encouraging you to improve as a player.

Also, since players get transported to the nearest resurrection shrine, it can be used to skip across areas that would otherwise prove too difficult. A simple example of this is the explorable area outside Lion's Arch - coming from the Gates of Kryta mission, people can suicide in the Tengu field and pop up nearby Lion's Arch, even though they failed to meet the challenge of the road leading to it. A simple fix for this would be to limit resurrecting only to shrines you explored to previously, perhaps even limiting it to shrines you visited in the course of the current instance (this would also address issues with mobs placed too near resurrection points, possibly causing never-ending deaths on respawned people).

Personally I'd prefer to see them go entirely: if players get a chance to resurrect, so should monsters.

Loviatar · May 14, 2005, 02:06 PM // 14:06

after a few rez the dp is big enough that i start over

taking them out would make it impossibly difficult for some people so they will stay

they are catering to the brute force market as well as the strategy side

if you dont want to use the shrine map back to the town and reset everything

just because other people *cheat* does not mean you are required to also

Jackell · May 14, 2005, 02:42 PM // 14:42

I acutally have to disagree with this idea.

I can't count how many times I've been so close to a town, and have a henchman run off for some god knows why reason and attack a group of 800000 mobs *yeah, I'm lookin at you Stefan* in which we all get party wiped 2 feet from the door.

Red Memory · May 14, 2005, 02:54 PM // 14:54

This is indeed a good idea.

I must admit that I have used this 'exploit' to get to new areas. I just rush through the zone, hopefully getting close enough to the other shrine before I die. With I have succes with almost all the time.

I've also 'fought' my way through otherwise too hard areas for me at the time. I charge a huge group of mobs, in hope of killing at least one maybe two. This takes a bit longer, but even with 60dp I can take them down after a while. One by one.

This has been my way of 'exploring' new areas. I've done it to get to new, cooler areas, but I admit it takes away the fun.

My vote would be to remove the shrines completely. Except near towns. But I know a lot of people would protest loudly. Therefor please implement the 'explore-shrines' suggestion. You can only get ressed at a shrine, if you have previously been there. THAT would make GW much more exciting.

My two cents..

Dubby · May 14, 2005, 03:55 PM // 15:55

Why not just make a "hard mode" where the shrines are limited, or gone. Then everyone's happy.

dro_china town · May 14, 2005, 04:40 PM // 16:40

i get wiped out any ways man.. this game is to challaneging.. i wanna bite you for saying this..
~

my morale went to -60% ~~ i couldnt continue.. ive been doing missions to get to yaks bend for so long but i keep getting mess ups..

Jackell · May 14, 2005, 05:36 PM // 17:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Memory

This is indeed a good idea.

I must admit that I have used this 'exploit' to get to new areas. I just rush through the zone, hopefully getting close enough to the other shrine before I die. With I have succes with almost all the time.

I've also 'fought' my way through otherwise too hard areas for me at the time. I charge a huge group of mobs, in hope of killing at least one maybe two. This takes a bit longer, but even with 60dp I can take them down after a while. One by one.

This has been my way of 'exploring' new areas. I've done it to get to new, cooler areas, but I admit it takes away the fun.

My vote would be to remove the shrines completely. Except near towns. But I know a lot of people would protest loudly. Therefor please implement the 'explore-shrines' suggestion. You can only get ressed at a shrine, if you have previously been there. THAT would make GW much more exciting.

My two cents..

But... but... but....

How are we going to keep Stefan from screwin us?

Silmor · May 14, 2005, 05:54 PM // 17:54

Quote:

But... but... but....

How are we going to keep Stefan from screwin us?

That's a seperate problem, isn't it? I doubt these resurrection shrines were put in as a 'fix' to incidental wipes due to pets or henchmen.

I'm just worried Guild Wars is gradually being made easier and easier because the least competent players keep complaining it's "impossibly difficult" - for example, the Charr Flame Temple where you go for the Althea's Ashes quest was 'rebalanced' recently and although it was an exciting and interesting challenge before, now it's a boring Charr-slaying fest that requires little more than a pulse to finish. The resurrection shrine being right next to the platform where you find the ashes apparently wasn't helpful enough for some people.

If a quest is too hard, you can always come back later and finish it with a better character or group. If a quest is too easy, there's only disappointment (except for the people only staring at their experience gauge, but I thought this game didn't cater to those).

Jackell · May 14, 2005, 06:05 PM // 18:05

Wait, they n00berized Altheas Ashes?

Dammit. STUPID NOOBS LEARN HOW TO PLAY THE GAME BEFORE YOU COMPLAIN ABOUT IT!

I know I'm usually a nice guy, but that pisses me off.

Lazarous · May 14, 2005, 06:30 PM // 18:30

Altheas ashes was a lot *lot* harder than any other quest in ascalon and its rewards are minimal.

I have to vehemently disagree with any suggestion to weaken resurrection shrines. You die 3 times and you're essentially worthless as is.

Laz

Silmor · May 14, 2005, 06:38 PM // 18:38

Yep. The level 28 beastmaster boss in Shiverpeaks as well, he's been reduced to a teensy level 14 wimp. So much for players learning about interrupting, or special distinctions between quests.

Althea's Ashes was difficult, but at 2000 experience was also as numerically rewarding as doing a full mission and sidequest. The place also had (has, actually) excellent drops for that early in the game. But the best reward was the feeling of bliss when you were able to clear it without a single death in your party. I saw a thread on doing Althea's Ashes on the previous difficulty, and it had people saying they could solo it with their warrior. At continual 60% DP. By repeatedly lunging themselves at one Charr, bringing it down before they died.

If that's the sort of solution people come up with, I can understand why they consider it 'impossibly difficult'.

Red Memory · May 15, 2005, 07:05 AM // 07:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silmor

That's a seperate problem, isn't it? I doubt these resurrection shrines were put in as a 'fix' to incidental wipes due to pets or henchmen.

I'm just worried Guild Wars is gradually being made easier and easier because the least competent players keep complaining it's "impossibly difficult" - for example, the Charr Flame Temple where you go for the Althea's Ashes quest was 'rebalanced' recently and although it was an exciting and interesting challenge before, now it's a boring Charr-slaying fest that requires little more than a pulse to finish. The resurrection shrine being right next to the platform where you find the ashes apparently wasn't helpful enough for some people.

If a quest is too hard, you can always come back later and finish it with a better character or group. If a quest is too easy, there's only disappointment (except for the people only staring at their experience gauge, but I thought this game didn't cater to those).

I completely agree here.. There's no fun in doing easy quests..
And about putting in a 'hard mode' is no sollution. Then you will have players going 'easy' to get the best rewards, creating a complete unbalance. Except if you had different server-worlds: Easy/Hard.. But that's a whole other issue.

Still voting: Remove Ress Shrines.

DavisMarkin · May 15, 2005, 07:59 AM // 07:59

That's what missions are for. Wipe = restart.